I’ve had many Lexuses. On the 90’s models, the Pioneer system was great. On my most recent 2016 Lexus, the Levinson system was irritating. A slight increase in treble hurt my ears, and the bass too, was more irritating than pleasant.

As for the JBL in my Avalon, I like it better. Overall, it is quite great good, better than the more recent Lexus systems I’ve had, and better than the Burmester system in a recent Mercedes. It has a powerful amp., and to my ears, little distortion. The stereo setting yields better overall sound than the surround sound setting.

Keep in mind audio quality is subjective; it is very dependent on the speakers and acoustics of a car’s interior.

 

As for the JBL in my Avalon, I like it better. Overall, it is quite great good, better than the more recent Lexus systems I’ve had, and better than the Burmester system in a recent Mercedes. It has a powerful amp., and to my ears, little distortion. The stereo setting yields better overall sound than the surround sound setting.

Don't understand why they set surround sound 'ON' by default in the Avalon. For one the sound is terrible and secondly it seems just the opposite of what surround sound should be. With it on it makes it seem like all the sound is coming from one speaker just above the console.

 

So, JBL owners... particularly those who pump up the volume from time to time... what are your thoughts as to sound quality?

:thumbup: or :thumbdown

I tend to listen moderately loud when alone in the car... but I usually do not go extreme. I have not physically found all 14 speakers... but I haven't really explored either. I suspect that some of the physical speakers have multiple elements.

It has 3D sound (or something like that). I've found that to be dependent upon the source material... sometimes making a dramatic improvement, and sometimes not so much.

The volume control can be really wonky. It is a continuous turning control that does not have stops. There is a lag... so if you start turning it up (especially if you do it quickly)... nothing happens immediately, and then it overshoots where you think you are setting it. If you are familiar with hysteresis... that is probably the best description. I have to train myself to turn the knob more slowly than I might otherwise. I also tend to use the steering wheel buttons more, which helps mitigate the design problem.

Initially, before I set up the audio properties, it was really pre-set with way too much bass. After adjustment it seems much better.

Spatial imaging seems occasionally inconsistent across various source material. I normally place the focus point on the centerline of the car, and positioned just behind front seat headrests. That tends to give me the best balance of front to back sound. However, with some source material, I cannot hear the rear speakers very much, or in some cases, not at all. Even the rear seat passengers said they could only hear the sound from the front. I haven't pinpointed exactly what causes that to occur. I generally listen to XM or my own material from my iPhone using CarPlay. I do not think it is actually the input source... but rather the actual media that is playing.

All in all, There are a few quirks, but I am overall happy with the audio. I would give it a thumbs up.

/Jim

 

With surround turned off it is great.

 

Great sounding system

 

In other settings off means it is off. I can't tell the difference but my hearing is not good. My wife likes it better when it says off. I guess setting it to what sounds best is the answer.

 

It’s too bad the button doesn’t read as “turn off” or “turn on”. Then it wouldn’t be so ambiguous.

 

As Zinger14 and BigJack78 mentioned, there is a stark difference in settings. When it says "ON" there is no surround effect at all; It almost doesn't even have much stereo effect either, seemingly coming from the front center speaker. As soon as you change it so that it says "OFF"... the full surround effect fills the car. That is what lead me to believe what they are really saying is "Turn OFF" and "Turn ON" like you mentioned. It is possible that some engineer just got the polarity wrong, and coded it backwards.

In any case, there is no doubt about it -- When it says OFF, you get the full Surround effect. The quality of that effect does appear to have some dependency on which music is playing.

/Jim

 

I have a 2018 Camry XSE with the upgraded JBL System - if the rear deck is anything like the Camry in Avalon you're in for a real treat. Dont bother turning up any bass on the car as all the clips toyota has used obviously weren't spec'd in properly. Doors rattle and rear lid rattles - SUPER annoying. Even Rock&Roll not just your thumpy hip-hop sounds bad. Heck Ive even played Jazz and get rattling. Toyota service reps stated they heard it too (definitely didnt sound right) but Regional Manager says there is nothing they will do under warranty or replacement as it doesn't affect drive ability nor is it a safety hazard. Terrible service from a company that usually shines above all others.

 

According to my experience, the problem you allude to is a Camry problem, not applicable to the Avalon.

 

All the talk about the surround system in this car and it's inferior quality is BS in my opinion. This car, by far has some of the most advanced digital imaging (spacial location) that I have had the privilege hearing. I come from a very thorough, seasoned, battle tested (literal) sound competition background. I've owned bass machines, sound Q machines, etc. In my home I use Bose, Bang Olufsen, Boston Acoustics, Klipsch, etc. The debate, or should I say complaint about the surround sound system in this car is being misunderstood by the user. The Surround setting that JBL uses as it's descriptor sets the dash as your stage. It centers voice through digital imaging through the center channel speaker...right into the center of the dash. It's not going to come out of every speaker in the car to give you a surround sound, as that is NOT WHERE THE SINGER IS SINGING FROM. Do yourself a favor and listen to Dream Theater in the car and you can hear the music change directions between speakers through the car so masterfully, it's a thing of beauty. Or, Pink Floyd, Buffalo Springfield, will do the trick too! It's really cool listening to the guy sing to you from your left ankle or at the right A pillar. When you turn off the surround setting all voices come through all speakers sounding like the car stereos did back in the day when there were no cup holders, and gear shifts on the steering columns and fuzzy dice. When I sat with the engineers from JBL at SEMA in Las Vegas this past year I got to further understand their digital imaging architecture that they used to build the sound into the car. It's very involved, and that may be the problem, as what is complete digital spacial voice and tone understanding and enjoyment from one person to the next, may not be enjoyed in the same manner. See video to understand more. I had the privilege to do what this guy did, but did not video it.

So, that was all the good. Now the bad

It's a powerhouse therefore you will expect rattles. It's got a subwoofer in the trunk deck, which moves air up the glass into the headliner. This is where I have had my issues with annoying rattles. It's to be expected. I think it was overlooked by the engineers. I've taken it back to the dealership to get the rattle taken care of, and it's fixed so far.

The gas door will rattle too.

Causes headaches when leaving work after a stressful day listening to extremely loud classic rap, rock,etc

Kids cannot be heard in the back seat

Wife cannot be heard as well complaining about the level of sound.

The mirror glass vibrates terribly because of the midbass speaker in the doors, actually that is impressive if you ask me. Also same for rear view mirror.

Folks in the back seat will not get as good of an "image" since most of the stage is set in the front seat. But....they are not making the payment, I am.

It's a badass very good stereo system if you ask me. Educate yourself about it's origins and why it does what it does. I'm glad I spent the money for it.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Ln5NS1quZQ

Here's the thing: like everything else in the human body, our hearing is very adaptable and if you listed JBL equipment for a long time it would sound like "nothing else" to you, but in reality it sounds artificial and weird.

 

I’m fairly familiar with multi channel/surround sound on mid level consumer home gear. While the JBL Surround setting nails the center soundstage, at least for midrange/vocals , the rest of the frequencies sound woefully weak at moderate to quiet volumes, resulting in a sound, to my ears at least, not unlike what I recall emanating from the mono dash speaker of an AM radio. The frequencies and overall sound does fill out considerably though when the volume is cranked.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Exactly! I can feel the other speakers if I touch them... but I can only hear the front center speaker.

/Jim

 

What you are experiencing is known as the Fletcher Munson Curve. It is basically the loss of high and low end frequencies at soft and sometimes moderate volume. If you are old enough like me, you may remember the "loudness" or bass boost that earlier stereo systems used to have. While I do not own a new Avalon it is on the radar for me later on in the year. It is possible that the audio guys at JBL and Toyota have the system set up to be flat at a fairly high sound pressure level.

For you owners, here is an interesting thing you can try. You can download a loudness app on your phone and this measures the sound pressure level in decibels. Fire up the app and the fire up the radio. Play a really good source if you have it and crank the volume to you are happy with the sound. See what the SPL is at that point.

As far as hearing only the center channel. Try turning off the surround mode and see if that makes any difference.

regards,

10

 

to my ears system sounds great(with setting set to surround off) it takes more power to push 14 drivers it would benefit from a loudness button for lower level listening--there is a “Automatic Sound Levelizer" setting will see if it affects low volume listening just a thought---

 

After all the comments I tried turning Surround off hoping things would sound better. Instead, it just seemed a lot quieter and less dynamic with it off. So I turned it back on. Just my 2 pennies.

 

I'll have to try the jbl system in the new Avalon. I have the jbl system in the 2018 Camry and I wasn't all that impressed with default tuning. That being said, my other car has a $4k 2 way system tuned with DSP and TA. I'll do a sound measurement on the stock jbl system and post the results.

 

Coming from a 2015 Camry V6 XSE with the 11 speaker setup, I say the 2019 Avalon speaker on the limited 14 speaker setup is hell of a lot better. Just remember to turn off the surround effect on all audio sources.

 

Is the surround setting common across all sources... or can it be independent for each source? I always assumed it was common, but your post makes me question my assumption.

/Jim

 

I'd say the JBL system is pretty solid. I'm more of an audio enthusiast than a professional or audiophile (I like to enjoy my music, not analyze it). I wouldn't put this against the likes of the Lexicon systems that Genesis uses, or some of the older Mark Levinson stuff that Lexus had (haven't heard anything newer than a 2012 GS with ML), but there's plenty of detail and body to the sound that I find it really enjoyable, and I find it a hell of a lot better than the B&O system in a long-term Audi A3 loaner I had a year or so ago, and easily better than the Bose system available in the 2015 Q50 I had for a while.

My only gripe with the sound system is all the rattles it brings out. Some of those were taken care of by the dealer, but I'm just gonna have to find some time to open up the doors and do it the right way.

I'm gonna have to go against the grain here. When I test drove the car, specifically the sound system, the first change I made was to turn off the surround feature, and I thought the difference was amazing and asked myself why anybody would ever turn it back on. Well, I did just that a week ago, and left it on, and now I can't go back. You may feel like you're losing some minute dynamics with it on because it's routing more sound up front to the dash speakers, but oh my god the soundstage and imaging are *so much better* with it ON. Vocals actually come *from the center of the car* instead of sounding like a conglomeration of each speaker. Look, I'm all for turning off as much processing as I can (I only have a stereo setup for home theater and listening), but I'm also not stubborn enough to not give something an honest try, and after living with it for a week I'm asking myself why anybody would go back to having the surround effect turned *off*. I have tried switching it off once in a while, and when I do it literally sounds like a gigantic, incoherent mess. You lose any semblance of imaging.

Comparing them back-to-back, to me, with surround off, it sounds like you're listening to a speaker (where "speaker" includes all relevant drivers) in each door try to play the same thing at the same time. There's some evidence of stereo work going on, but it's never a real cohesive image of the sound. With it ON, all of a sudden they're working together to put things exactly where they're supposed to be in terms of where it sounds like they're coming from, and that is some magical stuff. I'd encourage some of you who initially (like me) blew it off as sound-processing garbage to just give it another real try for a few days. Some of you will still hate it, that's fine. But some of you, like me, will never go back.

Disregarding the surround processing, I'd still say the sound overall is very nice. I have a pair of the original Sony MDR-1000x headphones, and the overall signature reminds me a lot of them, which is a good thing in my opinion. A little softer around the edges than some higher-tier offerings, but overall a system that's pleasant and easy to listen to, again in my opinion. I went off the deep end this summer with some used Bowers&Wilkins CM6s2 speakers, an Emotiva XPA amp, and SVS PB-3000 subwoofer for my home. The Avalon's JBL system is not in the same league, but I find that I enjoy listening to it just as much, and at least part of that may be due to the frankly amazing image it produces with the surround processing turned on.

 

Interesting read, I haven't heard this system yet to comment. It's good to know that I won't be ripping the car apart day 1 to install new speakers, amp, and wiring.

The benchmark is the Volvo Bowers and wilkins system currently. I don't this $600 msrp system can complete to the $3000msrp Volvo.

 

I thought the system sounded really good with XM radio until today. I read the Lexus 350 forum daily also since they seem to be a lot more active over there, and a relatively recent member suggested some settings for their upgraded audio system. (Treble -3, Mid -2, Bass 0, Surround off, and Sound leveling off). He further suggested that ultra high quality audio sounds pretty darn good, and suggested free download sample from the web site HD Tracks.

I downloaded the free high resolution sample with about 15 various songs on it from a variety of genres, and then listened to it using an old 6GB USB drive, and some audio settings suggested on the ES350 forum. Shortly thereafter, I splurged today on a 256Gb flash drive, and a membership / subscription to the HD Tracks service, and I bought my first digital music albums EVER. (https://www.hdtracks.com/).

I would strongly suggest that anyone who thinks that their premium JBL system isn't high quality, try this little experiment. I had the volume as high as 50, and it sounded to my old ears simply incredible. We're doing a 400 mile trip tomorrow, so I'll double check my opinion with my wife, but I think she's going to be really pleased as well.

 

So I was curious. Went out to my Limited. Tuned to SiriusXM, and 'Heartbreaker' by Pat Benatar was playing. Backed off Bass= -2, Mid=0 and Treble to +1. No change in the balance from front to rear or side to side. 0/0.

Touched/pressed Surround to OFF. Which, as previously mentioned, makes it functionally now ON. Sound Field Expanded. Cranked it way, way up. Sounds fantastic; No rattles either and very loud in the cabin.

To me it really comes down to the source material; each music genre' sounds different and likes it's own 'equalization' curve. Jazz, Classical, '50s mono, '80s Pop. But you already know that, yes?

It's a killer system for the money, and very glad I 'trimmed up' from a XLE to a Limited to have it. That's my experience.