The knock sensor just tells the ECM to adjust the timing, basically. It sounds to me (even though I can't hear it from here) that since you've checked the top end, it's okay, so the only other possibilty would be the bottom end, such as a connecting rod bearing. Have you checked the oil (in good light) to see if it's sparkly, as in metallic particles in it???

 

Could this be a problem with your EGR vavle getting transmitted to the exhaust?

 

Was the knocking there since the rebuild or did it come well after? Were the timing chain rails replaced and is the drivers side one metal?

I'm just trying to piece things together in my mind a little better. If the plastic rails were put back in, it might be possible that one broke and the guide is hitting the cover again.

Were the valves adjusted hot or cold? They should be adjusted hot. Was the bearing clearance checked on ALL of the bearings? I know it sounds stupid but some people trust their machinist's too much. I plastigauge EVERY bearing just to make sure no mistakes were made. That way I know what to eliminate when something goes wrong. Some guys don't double check anything and some only check one or two bearings then figure the rest will be OK too.

I had a lifter noise that I adjusted out. The sound reverberated through the exhaust like TNRabbit said.

Also stick a magnet in the oil and see if anything sticks to it. After draining it of course.

How about oil pressure? Did you check that? Maybe the oil pump tensioner was over torqued or the pump wasn't primed.

I know it's a lot of stuff but these are the most obvious things I can think of. Maybe probuilder will have some other thoughts.

 

Very Loud knocking

Hey guys, thanks for the replies.

I have no metal particles in the oil (checked with magnet). The noise has been there since the rebuild. I have no comparison because I bought the truck with the motor apart.

I did check all bearings for clearances, everything checked out. I tried the test where I pulled each plug while the engine was running to eliminate each cylinder for piston slap, ring problems, wrist pin problems, etc as outlined in the factory service manual. The noise never changed.

I adjusted the valves hot (twice to check myself) and the clearances remained the same after I adjusted them the first time after the engine got the operating temperature.

I am going to remove the valve cover again tonight and double check the clearances, check timing chain, guides, tensioner, and the bolt that could be too long through the timing chain cover.

I used a sonic device from work that we use at a natural gas compressor station to found noises in the engines and all the noise was coming from the exhaust side and loudest from the EGR tube above the manifold. It really echos through there, but that may be normal. I checked the EGR valve and no ticking in there as well as put vacuum to it and it killed the engine immediately and the service manual said the system is working it that happens.

Another note, the clutch, PP, throw out bearing and pilot bearing are all new, new fluid in the manual transmission. I use a toyota oil filter. I have no fluid leaks, oil pressure is good, water temperature is good. This really seems to be in the top end or the exhaust manifold, but I can't find it. After I check the valve train and timing, I let you'all know it that was the problem.

Thanks.

 

You say "loud knocking" Is it constant, does it ever change pitch.

You mean like a sledge hammer hitting the vlave cover, or a fingernail tapping glass?

Describe it better please.

 

To me it sounds like a lifter knocking like on a old ford 302. It never really changes pitch. It is really loud during the initial high idle while it is warming up and the sound slightly decreases as the idles comes down to the normal 750 rpm after is warms up. However, it seems to disappear (I think) when I rev it up after it has warmed up (about 2500 rpm) but when I drive it, it is definitely there and pretty loud at all rpms except when I let off the gas and let the transmission decelerate the truck. I'm wandering if this could be a fuel problem (too rich, too lean) but I would think this would show up on a code. Maybe not. I am stumped.

Thanks for the quick replies.

Jason

 

Just guessing, but it sounds like the valves / rocker arms tapping.

Dont get me wrong, but did you go exactly by the book when adjusting.

I remove my ground cable, put my truck in second gear, adjust them at top dead center, then roll the truck, and adjust again, etc, etc.

You can search "adjusting valves" here.


I know how bad noises can bother you after a labor intensive job.

I have a tapping noise now , but only on startup.

 

Phocus,

I adjusted the valves exactly like the service manual stated. Unless I misunderstood something. I let the engine get to normal operating temp. to adjust them hot. I set the #1 cylinder on TDC on compression stroke and adjusted the two intake valves to 0.008 and the two exhaust to 0.012. Then I rotated the engine 180 degrees and adjusted the other two exhaust and intake valves. The third time I adjusted them, they had not changed from the second time. I am also wandering if I could have a problem with a rocker arm. With the sonic device, I could not tell any difference between any of the valves. I know this doesn't eliminate the possibility, but you would think I would have the specific valve or rocker arm.

I am going to check things out tonight and verify clearances again, check the springs, timing chain, etc. It is probably something simply that I am overlooking.

Thanks.

 

Okay after reading the manual one more time, do I need to adjust the valves cold? The manual states COLD 0.008 intake and 0.012 exhaust. It says adjust COLD and then warm up engine and the re-adjust. I somehow misread this to begin with. Is this right and does it mean to let the engine cool back down before re-adjusting or is it a misprint in my manual?

Thanks for the replies

 

Sounds like your good on the valves, lots of arguements on valve adjustments, some say hot 7/11 some say cold 7/ 11, others say 8/12.

Maybe your chain slapping something, or a problem with your rocker arm/assembly?

 

Check this out.


http://www.wheelingadventures.com/Tech/Fixs.htm

 

Hey thanks Phocus,

I will definitely look at my spacers and check out the centerline of the rocker arm compared to the centerline of the spring tonight.

Thanks again.

Jason

 

First what I have seen, a bunch on 20R and 22R engines, Overtightening the valve cover will cause the valves to make a bunch of noise.

Second, Do you have any experience with these engines? They are all noisey to some degree or another. Most people would listen to mine and say it is about to blow any minute.

Bottom end noise is not usually as evident at idle as it is at higher revs and under load.

If you got the wrong bolt in the "top" position off the oil pump it could be interfering with the timing chain tensioner. this would allow more play in the timing chain and would make some noise.

 

Vicoor,

The valve cover is undertightened if anything. I have seen this in many of your posts and was aware of this. I'm not real familiar with 22re, but I do have quite a bit of experience in Ford and Chevy (junk is all I ever owned until I finally starting buying Toyota).

I helped rebuild my father's truck (1991 4X4 w/ 22re) and his isn't 1/4 as loud and that is mainly what I am going off of. Other than the noise, it seems to run like a top, but I really seems overly loud.

The long bolt you are referring to is in the correct location. I checked again today, and the timing components seem in good order and the noise definitely appears to be coming from the valve train. I tightened the clearances to 0.007 and 0.011 and it appears that made it little worse (I think). Definitely didn't help it. The #2 and #3 spaces appear to be in good shape on the rocker assembly and the adjusting studs on the rockers are in good shape. There is a small amount of wear on the pads of the rockers (cam side), but it is minimal. I am still thinking that maybe the exhaust manifold may be cracked or gasket not sealing good. I am going to put my tolerances but to factory spec and investigate more.

Thanks for the info.

Jason

 

If you have an exhaust leak you should be able to isolate it by using a long piece of vacuum hose. Hold one end close to your ear, (don't seat it in your ear). run the other end around the exhaust where you suspect the leak might be. you'll be able to hear it.

There is also a possibility that wear on the cam and rockers would cause it to be a lot noisier.

This is probably something that if I could listen to it in person, I could get you going in the right direction pretty well, But since you are almost half way across the country that's pretty hard.

 

I've tried the hose test and it sure sounds like the loudest noise is coming from the exhaust manifold. But it also gets a little lounder on the intake side near the bottom of the valve cover.

My cam is new so I'm sure thats not it, but it could be bad. I think my next step is going to be install my header after it gets here from Jegs and if that's not it, I think it about has to be my rocker arms.

I did check all my timing components again and everything is good. I'll let you know when I find the problem.

Thanks again everybody.

Jason

 

When I had my timing chain replaced in my 94 the guy had the timing off by one tooth. It created a loud knock that sounded like it was coming from the valve train towards the back of the engine. It ran quite nice but it sounded awful.
Just my .02

Tony

 

I've thought about the timing chain being off by a tooth, but wouldn't that make the timing way off. I definitely runs the best @ 5 degrees BTC @ 750 rpm with the diag. block shorted at the correct place (I know it's shorted because the check engine light comes on and the rpm drops slightly). My distributor is also pointing at #1 cylinder ( 11 o'clock) on TDC compression. Maybe I'm wrong on this, let me know if I am. I know I had a hell of a time getting the cam sprocket on the cam, but according to the manual that seemed pretty normal.

Thanks.

Jason

 

Another thought. Probably reaching for straws here, but I have two connectors that i cannot find where they go. I am sure that one is for A/C which I don't have and maybe both. My dad's truck has A/C and I think the light gray one is connected to A/C vacuum on top of the valve cover. The dark gray one I couldn't find, but it was raining and getting dark. Both of these connectors were kinda folded over like they were used. The guy I bought the truck from labeled every connection except these two. He did label another one NOT USED. So I wasn't sure about these. Hopefully the picture will show what I'm talking about. It isn't an injector, thought of that already. I can't find any open connections and nothing shows up on codes.

Thanks guys,

Jason

Shit, can you not insert picture from a file on your computer? Maybe I better read more about posting. Anyway, the wires on in the harness between the intake manifold and valve cover. One is dark gray and the other is light gray.

Thanks

 

The guy that did mine said there was no way that the timing chain was off. Everything looked great, the ignition timing was correct, distributor looked good, but when he looked back at the timing chain, the indicators were off one tooth. He said it had to do with when he put the tensioner in, it brought the timing back one tooth. I think someone talked about that in another thread on here. Apparently it is a mistake that is easy to make... I think.
Tony

 

Hey thanks Tony,

I am going to check it out. However, I think I found the problem. I decided screw it, I am basically starting over. I worked like a dog tonight to remove everything to remove the head and I went to loosen the head bolts (in the correct sequence) and they were not tight at all. Maybe had 30 lbs on them instead of 58 lbs. Appearently I made a crucial mistake and reused my old head bolts. I did retap the threads, but they were not tight. Damn, I wish I would have thought of that before I remove everything else and tightened them and see if that was for sure the problem. I was religious about torque throughout so I know I had them correct on the stand. Anyway the last time I ran it, it sounded like maybe the tensioner was not pumping up for 7 to 8 seconds like I have read in some of the other posts so I had decided it must be in the timing components. I may have overtightened the tensioner bolts, because I looked again and there were no specs in my manual on these bolts. Should have looked on the standard torque for the 8mm or whatever these are.

So I am just about back to square one with the rebuild. Only now I am a little (barely) bit smarter. I am going to use my torque wrench from work (which was just calibrated) to check my wrench at home. If it is off, I need to redo the bottom end too.

Thanks for all the help and when all the new bolts, gaskets, and seals come on, maybe I'll be back to where it should be. I let you'all know what I find. May be a one or so.

Thanks again,

Jason

 

Double check that it isn't your clutch assembly/throw-out bearing that is knocking. Push the clutch pedal in at idle and see if the knocking goes away, and vice versa to see if it comes back. I know your clutch is new, but it could be the source of the knock. Good luck!

 

i just did my head also. i torqued the bolts to 45 then 60ftlbs. then i ran the motor till it got to tempature then re-torqued the head. then drove around for a while and let it cool off then i re-torqued it again. i reused the factory bolts also and have no problems. i also use intiseize on any bolts that go into or through aluminum. keeps them from getting coroded.