What was your fuel pressure when this happened? Was there power to the fuel pump? Start at the basics, you have to have fuel, spark, and air to have combustion. You will have to duplicate the problem and then determine which system is giving you the trouble and go from there.

 

Does sound like a typical fuel pressure issue. Rather than holding the key and cranking it for so long, Try just clicking the key to the "On" position then back off a couple times before you turn it to start. If it fires up fine after that, the most likely issue is fuel pressure...

 

That is a great tip. I used that technique to diagnose a fuel issue in my old 4runner (ended up being a clogged fuel filter).

 

Brent,

I think you flooded it by trying to turn it over so much. That's probably why you smelled gas... At least that's what I've always been told. But I am no mechanic.

-Matt

 

All good points.

I have no idea what the fuel pressure was at the time. Like I was saying, this doesn't happen every time I go to start it, it just happens out of the blue. Maybe I will have the technicians focus on the fuel pump / system when I have it in there next week for some other work. And I am also not a mechanic but I find it strange that a fuel pump issue would be intermittant -- either they work or they don't -- right??

Thanx for the input so far.

Brent

 

It sounds like the same exact issue I have. Every now and then, say maybe a couple times a month, when I go to start my car it simply will not turn over even if I leave it cranking for 2-3 seconds. And if I turn it off and try again, it fires up very quickly.

 

simply will not turn over even if I leave it cranking for 2-3 seconds.

huh?? How can it not turn over if it is cranking? Stripped gears on the starter and flywheel?

 

Turn over = engine starting

 

Try swapping the EFI relay under the hood with a matching relay. Just a "guess" but it might have a "pitted" contact and it isn't making a good electrical contact on the initial "start" attempt.

Good Luck, keep us posted, please.

 

Excellent idea. I will have someone help me with that.

Another thing I have been hearing from some local fella's I've mentioned this to is that they think the security system / coded key might have something to do with it.

Brent

 

My experience with the security system issues were:
Car will start, run, then die within a few seconds.
The other issue was, no "idiot" lights on when the key was first turned to "RUN" before going to the "START" position.

Solution was a bad instrument cluster.

I am not sure, but the engine should "FIRE" before the security
kicks" in. If it is a security issue, the "SECURITY" light should be on and steady.

 

hehe

And just to show how 'intermittent' this issue is, it has not occurred in the 8 or 9 days since I made the first post asking if anyone was experiencing this issue.

 

And further on the intermittant thing, after going over 3 weeks without the hard start issue happening, it has happened 5 times over the past 3 days. Unfortunately I am on the road for work and cannot get to my dealer until next week.

Lordy this is frustrating.

Brent

 

One more update

The car spent the last few days at the dealer in hopes of getting this taken care of. Just so happens that a lady from Toyota Canada HQ out of Toronto was at the dealership (likely checking on the brand new showroom that was recently built - it is a beautiful new facility).

Anyway, I bend her ear for quite awhile discussing this issue and all the other issues I've had with the car in the 9 months that I have owned it (just for kicks, check out my post in the "Camry Problems + Work Done Thread") . Immediately, the lady from HQ got the E-TAS (sp) people out of Ontario involved. They ran a bunch of diagnostics on the car and came to the conclusion that a new ECM unit should be installed, so one is on order and hopefully it clears up the hard start issues.

 

I have the same issue still, it's getting to the point where if I'm near a crowd of people I am worried that my car isn't going to start on the first attempt, which can be quite embarrassing.

I can never seem to predict it though, but it does tend to happen more often if the car has recently been driving, versus being cold. Also I had a few 1K RPM flares recently when the car shifts from 3rd to 4th gear when the RPM's are around 2500-3200.

 

I have the same issue still, it's getting to the point where if I'm near a crowd of people I am worried that my car isn't going to start on the first attempt, which can be quite embarrassing.

I can never seem to predict it though, but it does tend to happen more often if the car has recently been driving, versus being cold. Also I had a few 1K RPM flares recently when the car shifts from 3rd to 4th gear when the RPM's are around 2500-3200.

I hear ya Geoff regarding the embarrasing part. But mine can happen at any time, not just after being driven.

In any event, the new ECM was installed yesterday. Hopefully this will do the trick. Just for kicks, I asked the Toyota technician working on my car how much this new ECM unit cost, and it was over $900. WOW!!! They don't give this stuff away, that's for sure.

 

Unfortunately it is back to the drawing board again, as the new ECM has not done the trick.

Anyone else have any ideas??

 

I've been playing around with it. Found out my valet key will work. It's gotta be something with the microchip in the key. Keyless entry works, remote start works, but somehow it lost the code or something. For those that are having the hard start, check and see if the valet key or the spare have the same problem.

 

altercall,

My issue seems to be a little different, unless I am reading your message wrong. My engine will turn over when I turn the key -- it seems to be turning over normally is if it wants to start, but it just won't catch and keep running -- like its not getting any gas or something like that -- but there is usually a strong gas smell, so it must be getting its gas. Very confusing.

I have a friend who had a new 4Runner about 2 - 3 years ago. His truck was doing the same thing as my car -- several months of start issues -- always starting on the 2nd attempt -- etc., etc. But then 1 day it wouldn't start at all and it stranded him on an out-of-town sports trip with his son's ball team. The fix was a new ECM -- never had the problem again in over 2 years after it was replaced. Unfortunately, that remedy didn't help for me. I can just see the day that my car won't start while I am on a 3 - 4 day work trip. It won't be a pretty site when I get the thing back to the dealer.

 

start with the basics. Air, fuel, and spark.

 

I mentioned it to the salesman I bought my car from, and he said to try using the second key that came with the car. He said that if you have only been using one key and that key has been in pretty rough shape (dropped, etc), then somehow it can cause an error with the anti-theft system, causing it not to fully turn over.

It's worth a try.

 

I'll check into that Geoff. There is an outside chance that this is the issue.