From the articles I have read they make it sound like nothing to take the auto tranny out and put the Manual one in. I would love to put a five speed manual in if/when my auto breaks
Camry98racer
Auto to manual, really worth it?
While I've never tried a Camry with a manual, I've tried a few other rigs comparing manual vs auto, and the manual always felt "peppier" on the rigs with small motors (4-bangers). Not so much with the larger motors.
Part of this is the weight (slushboxes weigh significantly more than a manual tranny), part is the efficiency (autos have a small amount of inherent slip until they lock up), and part is that a human driver tends to rev higher between shifts than what an auto is programmed to do.
The swap doesn't look like a slam-dunk to me, 'tho. A fun project, but it'd take a significant amount of time the first time you did it.
Part of this is the weight (slushboxes weigh significantly more than a manual tranny), part is the efficiency (autos have a small amount of inherent slip until they lock up), and part is that a human driver tends to rev higher between shifts than what an auto is programmed to do.
The swap doesn't look like a slam-dunk to me, 'tho. A fun project, but it'd take a significant amount of time the first time you did it.
yes, mine wasn't hard the only hard part with my swap was that the abs axle is different from the non abs
Yeah right now I'm in college and dont have that much time to do a project like this. But there is the summers. But I also don't have an engine lift. So I wouldn't be able to lift the engine out. If I could find a toyota camry 5 speed tranny at a junk yard that was in good condition for a low price I would really consider doing this. But with out and engine lift I'm dead in the water.
You don't need an engine lift if you're just swapping the tranny.
It's definitely worth the effort and every penny, too.
It's definitely worth the effort and every penny, too.
Ok great! I might even be able to get a discount on the tranny from the junk yard. I give them my working 4 speed auto. Does the tranny need to be from a camry of the same year? also could a use a supra tranny? what options would I have and which ones would be best?
let me put it this way:
a 4-banger with an autotragic tranny has a 0-60 of ~12-13 seconds (which is horrid; my friend used to have one, challenged me while I was in an Explorer with 3 other people riding along. Guess who won? :lol
.
a 4-banger with a manual is about as fast as as the slushpumper V6 (~8-second 0-60; not too bad, but could be better)
and the 5-speed V6 smokes em all despite it's conservatively-rated official 7.4-second 0-60 (it can drop into the 6-second range if you're a good shifter; ask EEng).
so, DO THE SWAP!!! :thumbsup:
a 4-banger with an autotragic tranny has a 0-60 of ~12-13 seconds (which is horrid; my friend used to have one, challenged me while I was in an Explorer with 3 other people riding along. Guess who won? :lol
.a 4-banger with a manual is about as fast as as the slushpumper V6 (~8-second 0-60; not too bad, but could be better)
and the 5-speed V6 smokes em all despite it's conservatively-rated official 7.4-second 0-60 (it can drop into the 6-second range if you're a good shifter; ask EEng).
so, DO THE SWAP!!! :thumbsup:
i've had 3 clutches and my engine droped twice all from the underside. 2x4 across the top with some chains to hold the engine, drop the sub frame with the tranny attached, the engine only needs to be unbolted from the trans, no screwing with the wiring harness or removing hoses. easy job if your handy around the car at most a weekend job.
supra trans is rwd you have fwd, not a chance in hell it will fit.
any trans that been bolted to the 5s will be fine (s52), the e(1)53 normally found in 2 gearings shoter on the pre 96 found on the 3vz and 3s-gte, and wider on the 1mz(97+)
also i been rumored the later (99+?) s52 were stronger and smoother shifting (an extra syncro)
supra trans is rwd you have fwd, not a chance in hell it will fit.
any trans that been bolted to the 5s will be fine (s52), the e(1)53 normally found in 2 gearings shoter on the pre 96 found on the 3vz and 3s-gte, and wider on the 1mz(97+)
also i been rumored the later (99+?) s52 were stronger and smoother shifting (an extra syncro)
Just a weekend job? I haven't done anything this major. So far I have raplaced the shocks (took 2 days), changed spark plugs, changed engine and tranny oil and filters, and changed brake pads. I mean is it really as simple as taking the oil tranny off and bolting on the new one? In the article I read the guy had to get a new front axle and an engine mount. But I'm not ganna lie you guys have pretty much talked me into it now :clap:
You need manual mounts. Axles can stay. You need the computer too. Wiring harness would be nice, but that's a lot of work.
I don't expect you to have it done in a weekend. You'll need to bypass the clutch start switch too.
The hardest part for me was installing the clutch pedal/master cylinder. Took me forever.
You don't need to drop the engine or move it at all.
I don't expect you to have it done in a weekend. You'll need to bypass the clutch start switch too.
The hardest part for me was installing the clutch pedal/master cylinder. Took me forever.
You don't need to drop the engine or move it at all.
ok not as bad as what that guys article made it out to be. When you say I need the computer and wiring harness would be nice. what are those things and could I pull them off the donor car?
The computer is behind the glove box. The wiring harness is the one for the engine, but I don't remember if you NEED it or not. I had one so I used it.
Yes they can be pulled from the donor car.
The clutch start switch will have to take some wiring. It's pretty much just a switch under the clutch that when you push the clutch to the floor, trips the switch and lets the computer know it's ok to start the engine. It's just a safety thing to make sure you don't start in gear, so it doesn't affect anything. Just don't start it in gear...haha.
Anyway. To wire it you'll need to find the black and white striped wire that looks like maybe a 10 ga wire that runs right up to the ignition module. Cut it. Splice in a wire long enough to go to the engine bay fuse box. Make sure you splice it on the end that comes from the harness, not from the ignition module. Then you can just tuck the wire under the starter relay connector.
Mine looks pretty slick, you can only see the wire if you're really looking for it. I took the entire fuse box apart to wire it, and I don't recommend doing that hahaha.
Anyway. If you have other questions let me know, as I just finished the swap two months ago.
Check out my cardomain page for some pictures too!
Yes they can be pulled from the donor car.
The clutch start switch will have to take some wiring. It's pretty much just a switch under the clutch that when you push the clutch to the floor, trips the switch and lets the computer know it's ok to start the engine. It's just a safety thing to make sure you don't start in gear, so it doesn't affect anything. Just don't start it in gear...haha.
Anyway. To wire it you'll need to find the black and white striped wire that looks like maybe a 10 ga wire that runs right up to the ignition module. Cut it. Splice in a wire long enough to go to the engine bay fuse box. Make sure you splice it on the end that comes from the harness, not from the ignition module. Then you can just tuck the wire under the starter relay connector.
Mine looks pretty slick, you can only see the wire if you're really looking for it. I took the entire fuse box apart to wire it, and I don't recommend doing that hahaha.
Anyway. If you have other questions let me know, as I just finished the swap two months ago.
Check out my cardomain page for some pictures too!
you dont need the manual ecu but it's nice to have if you got it
the wires to the solenoid are just grounded through hd resistors (like led load resistors, actual i'm redoing mine with those)
you dont need the clutch start you just jump the neutral start switch (the 2 thicker black wires going to the selector switch) but your car will start in gear and the clutch not down so you have to be careful there, you can use the clutch switch to close the start if you want.
if you look up from where the through hole for the brake is you can see a punch out for the clutch, remove the punch out padding and you can see the indentation for the peddle.
you can start doing the swap in advance like finding the clutch and brake peddles putting those in, if you need to move to a center parking brake, but if it took you 2 days for shocks i'll say give the trans a week to do.
lol i just noticed you have an 98 ..... well everything should be the same as i said, and the shifter from the gen 3 fits as well
the wires to the solenoid are just grounded through hd resistors (like led load resistors, actual i'm redoing mine with those)
you dont need the clutch start you just jump the neutral start switch (the 2 thicker black wires going to the selector switch) but your car will start in gear and the clutch not down so you have to be careful there, you can use the clutch switch to close the start if you want.
if you look up from where the through hole for the brake is you can see a punch out for the clutch, remove the punch out padding and you can see the indentation for the peddle.
you can start doing the swap in advance like finding the clutch and brake peddles putting those in, if you need to move to a center parking brake, but if it took you 2 days for shocks i'll say give the trans a week to do.
lol i just noticed you have an 98 ..... well everything should be the same as i said, and the shifter from the gen 3 fits as well
The auto ECU will throw codes, won't it?
And the speed sensors won't know what to do I've heard haha
And the speed sensors won't know what to do I've heard haha
i dont know how much they updated the ecu but, speed sensor are the same, the main sensor in the diff controls the speedometer and the other sensor is just so the ecu will know the speed of the planetary gears to know when to shift, so it will just figure you have it kicked in neutral and call it a day(well mine does 96 mz ecu).
for the solenoids they are grounded out under load resistors so the ecu thinks they are still there.
how ever mine does throw a code because the neutral start signal is present with out park or neutral being selected where one day i will use a rpm switch to fix that, i belive gino using the rpm switch from his smt to trick out his ecu.
you need to cut the pigtail for the reverse switch and wire it in so that when in reverse it will short the same 2 wires that need it to turn your reverse lights on,
now tho with out the manual ecu you loose, cruse control(i think i might of found a work around but dont expect answers for like a month or 3),
for the solenoids they are grounded out under load resistors so the ecu thinks they are still there.
how ever mine does throw a code because the neutral start signal is present with out park or neutral being selected where one day i will use a rpm switch to fix that, i belive gino using the rpm switch from his smt to trick out his ecu.
you need to cut the pigtail for the reverse switch and wire it in so that when in reverse it will short the same 2 wires that need it to turn your reverse lights on,
now tho with out the manual ecu you loose, cruse control(i think i might of found a work around but dont expect answers for like a month or 3),
Ok I'm doing this for sure now! You talked me into it lol. I'm ganna make some calls to junk yards I have been to and get a price on the tranny and clutch peddle and what not and if they will give a discount for my auto tranny.
I'm pretty sure I can get the ECU from the donor car. Though I have never seen where the ECU is on my car. You said the by the glove box?
I'm pretty sure I can get the ECU from the donor car. Though I have never seen where the ECU is on my car. You said the by the glove box?
Really? I was wondering why the cruise didn't work on the new car! haha. My old camry didn't have cruise but the car I swapped the engine and trans into did, but it never worked. Also only one reverse comes on for some reason.
Anyway.
To the OP. Apparently you can get by without the ECU, but that's up to you. personally I'd feel better swapping them too if you can get your hands on the M/T one. It's two bolts and three wire plugs.
You have to remove the glovebox to get to it. once you remove the box, it will be a small thin box with three wiring connectors (big white ones) going to it. The box is like, 6 inches long and 6 inches wide and maybe 2 inches thick. it's just metal, and silver.
No matter what you end up doing about the ECU, you'll have to custom wire something somewhere.
When are you gonna be doing this project?
Anyway.
To the OP. Apparently you can get by without the ECU, but that's up to you. personally I'd feel better swapping them too if you can get your hands on the M/T one. It's two bolts and three wire plugs.
You have to remove the glovebox to get to it. once you remove the box, it will be a small thin box with three wiring connectors (big white ones) going to it. The box is like, 6 inches long and 6 inches wide and maybe 2 inches thick. it's just metal, and silver.
No matter what you end up doing about the ECU, you'll have to custom wire something somewhere.
When are you gonna be doing this project?
If you enjoy pain, and solving problems, do it.
You will need a lot of new parts and it will be several days labor. The car is configured for an auto so you'll have to change some things to make it work. If you have more time then money, and really want it badly, then change it for what you want, to make it how you want it - you will learn a lot about the car by doing this major surgery.
You will need a lot of new parts and it will be several days labor. The car is configured for an auto so you'll have to change some things to make it work. If you have more time then money, and really want it badly, then change it for what you want, to make it how you want it - you will learn a lot about the car by doing this major surgery.
Just curious: do you, OP, realize how much it will cost to you? I saw a similar topic here with all prices. Labor was free. The total cost of this conversion was about 2,000 usd. Kinda a lot.
yeah i saw that article to. thats what scared me at first. I called around to some junk yards and the going price for the 5 speed manual is $80. and i would pull most of the stuff from the donor car. the guy in the article bought all new stuff for the most part and had the tranny shipped half way across the country lol. But I was thinking this summer would be a good time to do the swap. till then I can get all the parts together. All I have is jack stands and a jack. no engine lift or anything fancy like that. is it still do-able with that?
If you're working from underneath, then you don't need an engine lift. You'll need a tranny jack, 'tho.
I don't have a tranny jack. how much do transmissions weigh? I'm guessing around 200-300 pounds?
if you have a hydrological jack you be fine
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200332755_200332755
prolly can find it cheaper or rent one
edit: oh wow harbor freight wants the same price .........
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200332755_200332755
prolly can find it cheaper or rent one
edit: oh wow harbor freight wants the same price .........
The manual tranny isn't too heavy at all. You can lift it yourself, but you might want help to save your back.
I'm 120 lbs and 5' 6" and was able to lift it. It shouldn't be more than 100 lbs.
The automatic though, that's a heavy little fucker. haha. I've got one sitting in my driveway, mostly because I don't feel like lugging it inside my garage.
So you'll be good with just a hydraulic floor jack. I would recommend not getting the cheaper ones, as I had one from walmart and as I was jacking the subframe up, it collapsed.
It's one of those things you can use all your life, so might as well spend the extra and get a good hi-lift one.
I'm 120 lbs and 5' 6" and was able to lift it. It shouldn't be more than 100 lbs.
The automatic though, that's a heavy little fucker. haha. I've got one sitting in my driveway, mostly because I don't feel like lugging it inside my garage.
So you'll be good with just a hydraulic floor jack. I would recommend not getting the cheaper ones, as I had one from walmart and as I was jacking the subframe up, it collapsed.
It's one of those things you can use all your life, so might as well spend the extra and get a good hi-lift one.
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