Ok this is what I got...
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_12830_Metra-40-GM10.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_12875_Metra-40-UV43.html

So good and bad.

First off I know from electrical engineering (I never took a class directly discussing antenna design) simply paralleling antenna's is simply a bad idea, but I did it anyway. And there is a reason for this. Car's with a single antenna have them positioned so that they can received signals from 360*. FM is a somewhat directional signal (but can reflect off surfaces to approach from different angles). Because the antenna's are built into the rear windows and only face 1 side of the car, if you simply use 1 antenna, depending on how the car is oriented your signal strength changes drastically. Using only 1 antenna did just this, I had a good signal traveling 1 direction, but poor going another. This is why I decided to parallel them, so the car would have a 360* reception ability. Car's with fender antenna will NOT have this issue.

So what happened when I did this, with the antenna off, reception drastically increased. Its far improved, but still not the same as OEM. But there are still locations where I simply get static where I used to pick up a strong station. Turning on the antenna amplifier can help at times, but it kills it more often than not. With a strong signal and no cross signals, it came through clear. However as soon as one side of the car (ie 1 antenna) picked up a reflection of another signal, that signal is amplified. So you have 2 stations amplied over eachother. You literally hear 2 stations playing over eachother. If you kill the antenna amplifier this goes away as the reflection isn't as strong as the main frequency signal.

Ideally we need a diversity turner that actively switches between antennas. I'm shocked there aren't stand alone tuners. For more information this is the exact turner that was in my OEM navi unit. http://www.fujitsu-ten.com/business/technicaljournal/pdf/25-3.pdf

So for now I'm leaving my switch I installed on the antenna amplier installed as there are times the antenna amplifier makes the radio unlistenable. I will be switching it on/off frequently I bet.

I'm worried that due to directly paralleling the antenna's I've killed long distance reception. I'm going on a trip at the end of september in 2 weeks, I'll find out then. But I'm fairly certain I have.

There is a solution. As this radio has a single input, the car needs a single 360* reception antenna, ie a fender one or one on the roof. That is the ideal solution (I would do a roof mounted one). I am looking into this option, but will at least wait a few days to get a better grasp on how the radio is working.

This isn't a fault on the Android radio, its simply a fault of Toyota designing the car to always use a diversity setup, the antenna's simply aren't designed to be used individually. That is why other car's with diversity antennas have better results from using a single line (older 4runner for example, has a fender mast and a window antenna. They get good recption from only using the fender mast..ie 360* antenna).

 

That was a very well written of the issue I dealt with, for me I have 3 FM stations and 1 AM that I would care about and they work well enough on one antenna and so many bells and whistles came with the android HU that I stopped caring about the radio reception.

Question:

When you mention Antenna amplifier is that the 12V feed to the antenna or is that antenna amplifier you installed separately?


It seams like adding the antennas together still does a better job than just one but I will wait to hear more from you on this as I am sure you will not settle for sub OEM radio reception...
Anyone who knows you here knows that there is no mod too big for you :wink:

Keep us updated.

 

You/we may have to install an antenna in our vehicle...may a nice roof mount. I have yet to see units that work WELL with the diversity antennas.

I was rooting for you SweeneyP!:banana: But I had my doubts... :|

All the way home I was looking at the roofs (as well as some fenders) of other vehicles, check out the various antenna types. I looked at the (mostly) Ford types that have they integrated GPS/Satellite bump /8" whip-twisty FM antenna and a lot of vehicles that have the shark fin and some with the low profile 'shell/bump'.

So I pretty much want a shark fin antenna (better reception than really low profile). But!!!:

1) I want to test an antenna to make sure that the radio will get good reception on the roof of this big SUV BEFORE drilling into my roof to mount one.

2) Where exactly to mount it;

3) How to route the cable. Not looking forward to removing the roof liner.

4) Finding a nice Universal fit (or will the ones seen on later model Highlanders work for us?)

I've checked out:
Sigma Automotive
http://www.sigmaautomotive.com/FoliaTec/antenna.php

Beat-Sonic (at CarID)
http://www.carid.com/beat-sonic/shark-fin-antennas.html

Kenson Electronics Shark Fin Amplified AM/FM Antenna
http://www.amazon.com/Kenson-Electronics-Amplified-Antenna-Universal/dp/B006ZZQ9TU

 

No way I would drill into the roof before testing its reception first. By testing I mean ziptie to my roofrack and see how it works :lol:

I was also eye'ing that Kenson shark fin antenna. There are so few options out there, I was also eyeing this one: http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_32612_Metra-44-UA46.html But its lower gain (10-12dB on kenson vs 3dB on the Metra) had me doubting it. I'm kinda concerned I can't find ANYTHING on Kenson Electric...

The newer years, that antenna on the roof is for Sirius/XM, their FM/AM is just like ours.

Where to mount? I was thinking dead center of the roof (in terms of width) about a foot from the tailgate.

Wire routing shouldn't be too bad, poking it along from the side should work. Also its fairly straight forward to drop the rear headliner enough to get clearance to work.

Be careful with those beatsonic ones. They are designed to fit over existing exterior antenna's and use its setup. Not be standalone.

Question:
When you mention Antenna amplifier is that the 12V feed to the antenna or is that antenna amplifier you installed separately?

It seams like adding the antennas together still does a better job than just one but I will wait to hear more from you on this as I am sure you will not settle for sub OEM radio reception...

I'm talking about the 12V feed to the antenna (the amplifier is built onto the lines in the back of the car). I didn't add an amplifier, I added a switch to the OEM's powerline so I could cycle it on/off as I wish.

Combining is a patch fix at best, it will have unwanted consequences, I'm afraid, in long range reception and rejection of reflected signals.

 

I ordered the Kenson. It's a model KSA-150B (and Sears sells it too and a couple other resellers...have no idea who really makes it--no info on Kenson).

I used to install FM and CB antennas many, many years ago. Also cell phone antennas LOL.

BTW, antenna needs a ground plane (not just ground) to work well. My plan is:
Fasten a vehicle-grounded 10" square/circle of metal to a piece of wood; drill a hole and mount antenna to metal and fasten plate to wood; I have some magnets with screw holes so I will screw about 4 magnets to the wood then mount this thing on my roof; run the cables in the rear door window to my radio. Drive SLOWLY around the area and see how it works.

However, I would greatly appreciate it if someone beats me to testing it :grin:

EDIT: Although tie strapping it to the roof rack is probably a good test too

 

take some pics for us
had no idea about ground plane for antenna...

 

http://www.amazon.com/Sedeta®-Elect...B00Z93D5GY/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1442453614&sr=8-2&keywords=electronic+antenna

this is one of many variation available
mine is a different brand,same design
gets all the HD Radio ok.

it works hidden,but for best results stick it in the window

 

so this little thing takes over as the only antenna?
no need for any of the OEM antennas?

where did you get the 12V for this?
where did you put it?

of course HD radio applies if your radio can do HD radio, Android Head units do not do HD radio.

 

I get the 12v from the back of the radio.
is the only antenna I have and is sitting on top of the radio,I did not wanted the wires to show on the dash.
correct,the Alpine radio I have is hd radio capable.

 

thanks..

how would you compare the regular AM FM reception of this versus the OEM?

 

I got the car in february 2012 and the OEM radio was in car for a week,and I never listen to AM.
it's difficult to compare ,but oem was better on the far away stations.
I also put a similar antenna on a friend car he was very happy with it. It was mounted on top right of the windshield.

 

I see... I am not personally very sensitive about the radio reception
I just connected the big OEM antenna to the Radio so I am missing the small antenna on the other side of the car but does the job for me, I was wondering if this thing is a big enough of an improvement to try...
SweenP is more into this looking forward to see what he will end up with.

 

this thread is about to get convoluted...I'm going to dump some posts in here from another thread...sorry. I didn't want antenna discussion taking over that android thread.

Oh and yeah, those little electronic ones simply don't have the range needed.

 

There's always the Shark Tail antenna:

 

Not trying hard enough :lol:

 

 

http://djholman.csde.washington.edu/ww7d/FieldDay2012/IMG_3049.JPG

:surprise:
Is he trying to get a station or a jump (via lightning strike)???

 

Well got the antenna (love amazon prime).

I was worried it was going to be one of those pathetic antenna's with a fake pre-amp and I would be returning it immediately...kinda like this:

Well nope, was pleasantly surprised its a legitimate dual pre-amp antenna setup. I'm pretty optimist it will be work well.

And just to give an idea of size (note, not installed, simply put the cover on the roof). I'm going to have to paint the cover if I end up using this. The paint is very thin and the plastic is white under it. There were a few spots where it had rubbed through.

Testing comes later.

 

Yup, its the Kenson.

I personally am just going to spray paint it with Rustoleum's High Performance Enamel gloss black (if I can find my can...). Black is an easy color to get close enough to not notice shade differences IMO, so I'm not concerned with getting it professionally painted. Plus its on the roof, I'm not too concerned about quality of the paint job.

It came with an extension cable (full size radio plug to mini coax plug (coincidentally the same one used by the smaller antenna of the OEM diversity setup)). The antenna itself has a female connection for that smaller fitting. I haven't unraveled the extension, but I think I read online it was 12'. It may be cutting it close, I'll see later. Edit: it's just over 17'

Where I put it seems flat enough for the gasket to get good contact to the roof. It will work better once its tightened down which will help get the edges sealed. But regardless, I plan to put a seam of black RTV about 1cm inside of the edge of the gasket, as well as around the threaded mounting shaft (at the opening in the roof), and also on the inside around the nut/washers. I'm not chancing water with this.

BTW it came with a single nut to mount. Its an M12...something. I went to home depot to get other hardware and they only stock 1.75 pitch, and its finer than that. I wanted to get a nyloc nut and/or thinner nut (one it came with is 1/2" thick). But instead just got some big washers to spread the load out on the roof and some split lock washers to keep it tight once installed.

I plan to make the contraption to test reception tonight or tomorrow afternoon.

If this doesn't work out, I'm biting the bullet and getting a FM/AM antenna from a Venza.

edit: random, but been trying to figure out how they designed it. The long slant seems to be a ~1/2 wave FM setup, and the vertical one seems ~1/4 wave FM (in terms of wavelengths and lengths of the coil). I'd have to look at the board more, but I wonder how the 2 are working together.

 

My highlander is base with the outside rod antenna. Works great with my JVC with HD Radio.

 

did you connect the blue wire from the aftermarket radio?
I had the same rod antenna but I think I did not have the blue wire connected because I did not get any reception.
anyway I wanted to get rid of the external antenna because of the car washes.

 

My 09 hybrid looks like it has the antenna on the roof. Is this different than what you guys have?

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

 

ok, another round of good news/bad news

Bad news, I hate antennas (this is what happens when you use diversity setup on a non-diversity radio)

That, and I have to drill a hole in my roof now :lol:

Good news, that fm antenna worked great.

So I made my really janky mount for the FM antenna and ratcheted it to my roof rack.

Ran the new coax and 2 power lines (GND & amp power inside the car) and drove around.

So here is the thing. With its internal amp turned off, I picked up every single local channel, includeing the 106.7 I mentioned in other videos (in another thread) not being able to get locally using the jerry-rigged diversity setup. Turn on the amp and the signal is fantastic. Very clear. However I noticed there were a few noise spots in urban areas, though as soon as I turned off the internal amp, it came in clear again. In town performance is as good or just slightly less than OEM setup.

I'm optimistic about its long range ability with its internal amp. I'll know in about 2 weeks on a trip though. In the mean time I have a roofliner to pull down and a hole to drill....but that can wait till next weekend.

 

ok, another round of good news/bad news

Bad news, I hate antennas (this is what happens when you use diversity setup on a non-diversity radio)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79jDC-yTJWY

That, and I have to drill a hole in my roof now :lol:

Good news, that fm antenna worked great.

So I made my really janky mount for the FM antenna and ratcheted it to my roof rack.

Ran the new coax and 2 power lines (GND & amp power inside the car) and drove around.

So here is the thing. With its internal amp turned off, I picked up every single local channel, includeing the 106.7 I mentioned in other videos (in another thread) not being able to get locally using the jerry-rigged diversity setup. Turn on the amp and the signal is fantastic. Very clear. However I noticed there were a few noise spots in urban areas, though as soon as I turned off the internal amp, it came in clear again. In town performance is as good or just slightly less than OEM setup.

I'm optimistic about its long range ability with its internal amp. I'll know in about 2 weeks on a trip though. In the mean time I have a roofliner to pull down and a hole to drill....but that can wait till next weekend.

Glad you got it to work. It should look good, after mounting.

 

Alright its in and works great. Few things from install to help others

Using this: http://www.amazon.com/Kenson-Electr...r_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1443229065&sr=1-1&keywords=shark+fin+fm+antenna

-Comes with a 17' extension cable, ending in a standard large radio plug. Had about 3' left over after I ran the wire to the radio.
-Does not come with a long wire for the built in pre-amp
-Threaded shaft that goes through the roof is 12mm OD. You could use a a 31/64" drill bit if you want, that's only a hundredth bigger, however if you use a more common 1/2" bit, you'll have 3 hundredth of play and it won't be a tight fit. You should get the proper 12mm drill bit.
-It comes with a single nut. I got a 12mm washer and split lock washer to secure it. I also used threadlocker.

Stuff that's gotta come off to drop the headliner...

-So D-pillar panels need to come off completely (you can hang them by the seat belt). To do that the main side trunk panels need to be partially removed. Start from the back and work forward. Remove all fasteners from the strut towers back (including the ones hidden by the cover over the struts, and directly above it). It will be a very tight fit, but you should be able to get the d-pillar panels off to get the headliner down.
-Below each rear AC vents will be a small 1.5"x1.5" plastic cap on the roof. Behind the cap there will be a 10mm bolts. Remove them.
-AC vents are attached to headliner, leave them alone.
-Remove the middle roof light if you need too.
-Remove the rear trunk light. Take lens off (2 indention on the front to pry it off). If your looking at it, it will appear like a rectangle. If you draw a square in the middle, the outer left and right sides have a cover on them that pop off. Behind that there will be a clip you pull back to pop the light free of the roof.

There are 3 of these connectors:

1 on each side of the trunk light and one right in the middle of the trunk, remove it.

So once you drop the roof liner this is what your looking at

There is a a lot of stuff on the roof blocking access to the actual top sheet of steel. There is only a 4"x6" area where you have direct access to the roof itself. Its right in front of the trunk light, above a bunch of wires. To get better access you can move the wires out of the way by removing the 2 bolts highlighted on the right.

It will look like this once you drop it

Just to help visualize where the hole is, here is another picture.

I couldn't figure out a good way to describe this, so I drew the best drawing ever made in MS paint. So the hinges for the tailgate mount on a flat area that's about 2" below the actual roof line. There is a rise to the actual roof. My measurements were referenced from this rise. The hole was about 6.5" forward of that rise to clear all the stuff to get to that opening in the roof I showed above.

BTW don't cheap out on drill bits. This is a couple dollar 12mm one on amazon, I simply got it to drill this 1 hole. I drilled it and it snapped immediately after (as the reviews said it would, didn't believe it). Sad when a 12mm bit snaps drilling through 18gauge steel... :lol:

Painted both sides of the hole to prevent rust on exposed metal:

Broke out black silicon, DON'T use their ULTRA silicon, that's not meant for painted surfaces.

First thing I did was take the cover off (and paint it), but I also put a bead of silicon just inside of where the cover meets the rubber to help seal the unit up. Also put it over the screws to seal the screw openings.

Also put a bead around the threaded rod to seal around the opening. I also put it just inside of the rubber seal to help seal it to the body. There is an air opening on the back to vent moisture. Left that exposed.

Mounted it. Added washer, lock washer, and threadlocker. Note you will need a 2nd set of hands here. Someone is going to have to hold the antenna while you tighten from below. I didn't get it as tight as I wanted as the person couldn't hold it tight enough to keep it from spinning....

Got it on and was sitting a little to close to my roof rack, was actually hurting reception.

Moved the rack forward solved everything (and for those who said my crossbars would get stuck in place from rust way back when...nope )

And final pics of antenna on.

Now for running the wiring, I suggest running it along the passenger side roof and down that A-pillar. You can simply tuck the wires along the roof by pulling the weather stripping down from the door openings. Just make sure you get it deep enough to clear the curtain airbags. A coat hanger or long flexible rod can help pull/push wires where you hands won't reach.

Leaving next Saturday for a trip so will see what long range reception is like then.

 

nice
I guess it will be easier on mine to just replace the xm antenna with this one! I don't use the xm anyway

 

Not sure how they mount theirs, but its in basically the exact same mounting location.

 

I found a nice link that provides radio stations and their distance, signal strength, and format for a given location.

http://radio-locator.com/

This gives additional insight as to whether you should expect a station to be clear (i.e. if it is 35 miles away and/or has a low signal strength then it will probably be staticky) and also where to find alternatives. It doesn't account that some radios and/or antennas are better than others at handling weak stations or signal anomalies in certain areas (large buildings, signal reflections, etc).

 

Got back from my trip over the weekend. Ranged matched OEM antenna reception. I had major stations from Nashville up to ~50-60miles from the city (they were severely breaking up at this point, this was only the strongest local 3 channels). I had a signal well into Kentucky. Having said that, I wasn't constantly listening to it so I can't say it was constantly strong up to 50miles. Occupants were watching Star Wars in the back seats over the audio system :lol:

 

awesome,

I see why the radio did not bother me but you could not live with it, most radio stations I use are under 20 miles away.

 

I just got back from my weekend trip as well; I drove 730 miles from Michigan to South Carolina...because I just had to see hurricane Joaquin for myself :| I took I-75 there and I-77 back so I went through different states each way. There is definately a geographical difference in performance.

In Michigan, if I drive 44 miles from Ann Arbor to Detroit, the NPR stations in each city (both with signal strengths of 5) cut out in the other city. The NPR stations in the city in between (Romulus AKA Detroit Metropolitan Airport) can be heard in both cities. So the range is roughly 20 miles. In the wide open country the range is increased. I do not think it is the lack of obstacles as much as there are fewer frequencies and less multipath propagations due to buildings and even water near downtown Detroit as well as the before mentioned (Microwaves and RF article) complexities of the Ann Arbor area.

But definately, I did not change stations with the OEM radio. I had my most commonly used preset tuned to 91.7 for last 2 years.

Detroit
WDET | 101.9 FM | 8.5 mi. | Signal Strength 5 | Detroit, MI | Wayne State University | Public Radio
WUOM | 91.7 FM | 36.7 mi. | Signal Strength 3 | Ann Arbor, MI | University of Michigan | Public Radio

Romulus
WDET | 101.9 FM | 17.6 mi. | Signal Strength 4 | Detroit, MI | Wayne State University | Public Radio
WUOM | 91.7 FM | 31.2 mi. | Signal Strength 4 | Ann Arbor, MI | University of Michigan | Public Radio

Ann Arbor
WDET | 101.9 FM | 33.6 mi. | Signal Strength 3 | Detroit, MI | Wayne State University | Public Radio
WUOM | 91.7 FM | 16.2 mi. | Signal Strength 5 | Ann Arbor, MI | University of Michigan | Public Radio

---
FYI, since I like NPR a lot, I downloaded a podcast app for Android (my daily driver is an iPhone); what I will do is setup the app to download episodes everyday when I am in WiFi area and that way I can listen to news stories crystal clear (they are almost as updated as the original broadcasts). Also I will see if I can get to the source code for the MTCRadio app to rewrite it (some) so that it is better suited for long transits. I learned a lot during this road trip about how I would like to see it work.

 

look on XDA there are people working on the MTCradio modifying it
you should be able to find it with a bit of a search,
please keep us updated.

Thank you

 

I'm not too happy even with the stock radio, stock antenna setup. I'm thinking of replacing the antenna with another oem antenna. The one on my Ford fusion has fantastic reception. Probably try that. It's a shark fin, but I don't use xm, so I'll just replace that one.

 

Does anyone know if removing the factory xm antenna leaves a hole suitable for that Kenson sharkfin antenna or something similar?

 

I have basically the same question as @hrdwrguy above. I don't listen to XM radio (and I doubt that the cheapo aftermarket HU that I just ordered even supports it). So the most convenient solution to the diversity antenna problem is to disconnect the XM antenna and simply use the existing wiring and hole in the roof to mount a shark-fin FM antenna. Can anyone comment on whether this is practical? @sweeneyp? I know you pulled back your headliner drilled holes, ran new wires etc. That's a little more work than I'm prepared to do, and I'm hoping that switching out the XM antenna might be a reasonable shortcut.

BTW, it appears that the Kenson sharkfin antenna is no longer available.

 

Wow, never even saw his question from before. I think the XM antenna uses a square opening....I think. You'd need to confirm how the stock XM antenna is mounted.

The XM coaxial line will be a different impedance from a typical fm antenna coaxial. It'll still work, but it will hurt signal strength. But honestly, if you've taken the rear of the headliner down to swap antenna, its about 5-10min more work to run a new wire along the edge of the headliner and down the passenger a-pillar.