I'm wondering if its true what they say that the Xr engine is just a de-tuned version of the Xrs. If so.....how does one re-tune it? Short of a supercharger or a turbo, what can a Matrix driver do?
Travisty
The XRS uses a Yamaha-built 2ZZ-FE engine that's based on the 1ZZ found in your XR. If you want the power of the XRS, it's best to snap on a TRD supercharger. You might even run faster than the XRS. Otherwise, I'm not sure what you can do to the engine.
.There is nothign similar between teh 1zz and 2zz. They are not like honda where blocks mate to different heads, they are completely different engines.
The 1zz is a small diameter bore with a long stroke, the 2zz is larger diameter with a shorter stroke, which is why the 2zz revs to 8400rpms before cutoff.
You can't make your 1zz anything like a 2zz.
The supercharger will make it quicker and torqueyer, but you'll still only run 15s with intake, headers, exaust, tune, and supercharger.
The 1zz is a small diameter bore with a long stroke, the 2zz is larger diameter with a shorter stroke, which is why the 2zz revs to 8400rpms before cutoff.
You can't make your 1zz anything like a 2zz.
The supercharger will make it quicker and torqueyer, but you'll still only run 15s with intake, headers, exaust, tune, and supercharger.
I have a Toyota's official release technical document on 2ZZ-GE and it's differences with 1ZZ-FE.
The very first thing written in the document is "The only thing common between the two engine is the 1.8 liter displacement".
They have different header, bore, stroke, pistons, throttle body, block etc. They use different gear ratios where the 2ZZ-GE is coupled to a close-ratio 6 speed to keep it in the power band through shifts. 2ZZ-GE also squirts mist of oil for lubrication when it is pushed up to 8400 rpm repeatedly.
2ZZ-GE was completely independently built by Yamaha while 1ZZ-FE was built by Toyota itself.
The very first thing written in the document is "The only thing common between the two engine is the 1.8 liter displacement".
They have different header, bore, stroke, pistons, throttle body, block etc. They use different gear ratios where the 2ZZ-GE is coupled to a close-ratio 6 speed to keep it in the power band through shifts. 2ZZ-GE also squirts mist of oil for lubrication when it is pushed up to 8400 rpm repeatedly.
2ZZ-GE was completely independently built by Yamaha while 1ZZ-FE was built by Toyota itself.
Which is exactly why I like my 1ZZ better, Toyota quality. Depsite the power differences, I have more faith in Toyota than Yamaha.silver04rollas said:
Toyota would not sell a product that was unreliable. They went to Yamaha because Yamaha is specialized in small lightweight high reving motors. Maybe if Yamaha needed an impotent underpowered engine (purely for feul efficiency, no need for power) they would come to Toyota. Toyota is asleep at the wheel when it comes to sports cars, they are steadily becoming the Buick of Japan. Slow lame cars for old people, without concern for driving enthusiasts.thms05corolla said:
Many many people have had 2zz motors for many years without trouble, the only known issues are minor or driver induced. The original 2zz's snapped lift bolts left and right which toyota fixed, the only other problem with 2zz motor is when some moron downshifts too low and blows the motor up which is not Yamaha's fault. I'd really like to hear about how the 1zz is in any way more reliable than the 2zz.
Enjoy your 1zz dude, be glad you were not cursed with the 2zz (they suck afterall) :lol:
Well thats fine that you support the engine that you have in your car, but I prefer mine. But I refuse to believe that one of the best known car brands in the world would put out a engine (1ZZ) that is less superior than something they would second source out (2ZZ). I am not calling the 2ZZ a bad motor AT ALL, but in defense to your statement I do feel that the reliability of the 1ZZ is just as rock-solid as anything else Toyota puts out there. However, when people start adding forced induction (ie: S/C or turbo) I do feel that it takes away at from the reliability factor of those motors (like any one). You don't see as many problems from the 2ZZ for 2 reasons:
1) There are only 3 cars (Matrix XRS, Corolla XRS, Celica GT-S) that Toyota produces(d) that had that engine and none of them are really common, so naturally the amount of problems is lower. Considering that the Corolla platform is the highest selling car in the HISTORY of the world, the base model 1ZZ is VERY abundant and therefore weaknesses are more easily seen.
2) There are not many heavily modified 2ZZ's out there to gain a huge reputation of weaknesses/problems from. Given the 2ZZ is a more performance oriented motor, turbo and S/C kits are a lot more abundant for the 1ZZ, and like I said before that is where your problems come in.
From a performance stand point, hands down the 2ZZ all the way, but as far as reliability goes, both are fabulous, but I still want my Toyota quality.
2)
1) There are only 3 cars (Matrix XRS, Corolla XRS, Celica GT-S) that Toyota produces(d) that had that engine and none of them are really common, so naturally the amount of problems is lower. Considering that the Corolla platform is the highest selling car in the HISTORY of the world, the base model 1ZZ is VERY abundant and therefore weaknesses are more easily seen.
2) There are not many heavily modified 2ZZ's out there to gain a huge reputation of weaknesses/problems from. Given the 2ZZ is a more performance oriented motor, turbo and S/C kits are a lot more abundant for the 1ZZ, and like I said before that is where your problems come in.
From a performance stand point, hands down the 2ZZ all the way, but as far as reliability goes, both are fabulous, but I still want my Toyota quality.
2)
I think the point to be made here is it is all about personal preference. I have not driven an XRS, I currently have a 02 Civic EX Coupe with the SOHC VTec. That revs to 7800 and the power kicks in like the 2ZZ at a higher RPM. The VTec does not come into play until around 4500rpm and from then on it makes a difference, especially above 5k. But for me now, I commute everyday in traffic for a good 30-45 minutes average. Not to mention ice and snow conditions here. So I went for the dog of the group, the XR AWD automatic. Sure its slower, but lately I very rarely see myself hitting redline in my Civic in traffic and so an XRS just makes no sense to have. The AWD I found was plenty capable to get out of its own way and on an uphill on ramp it gets to 80mph with no trouble. I'm not looking for a rocket so it suits my needs.
Im sure this argument could go on for months on end, but its all personal preference and for me, having the XRS running on premium and being a higher revving engine makes no sense when I want the advantage of AWD and fuel mileage on regular. Besides, back to opinions and preferences, I would rather have a lower revving AWD than a high revving XRS where tires just spin at those RPM's which you would maybe 5% of the time hit in snowy weather.
Im sure this argument could go on for months on end, but its all personal preference and for me, having the XRS running on premium and being a higher revving engine makes no sense when I want the advantage of AWD and fuel mileage on regular. Besides, back to opinions and preferences, I would rather have a lower revving AWD than a high revving XRS where tires just spin at those RPM's which you would maybe 5% of the time hit in snowy weather.
i don't think the 2zz is any less reliable than the 1zz. Yamaha is one of the leading motorcycle and small engine builder in the world. They are also still based in japan and use japanese parts, even some chopper builders in the US, such as metrix choppers based out of North Carolina have switched to yamaha engines for reliability and low maitenence purposes.
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