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Can the new Camrys last a long time?

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36K views 243 replies 44 participants last post by  hardtopte72  
#1 ·
I’m not currently an owner of a Gen 8 Camry, though I plan to buy one in the near future (once this chip shortage/high price ends). I do own an 02 Camry with 342k miles and counting, and I‘d like for my next vehicle to last this long, if not longer.

Ok, there have been some lengthy discussions in regards to the engine oil, and I’m not trying to start another one, but can I increase the longevity of the engine by using 0w20 or thicker vs. the recommended 0w16? It’s my understanding they recommend this in order to squeeze as much fuel economy as possible, but the engine may not last as long. I believe the owners manual states you can use 0w20 if the 0w16 is not available, but you must add 0w16 at the next oil change. But it seems like I‘ve read that in other countries with lower epa standards, the owners manuals state you can use thicker oil at all times, despite the fact that it’s the same car (I’ve read where people said that, not sure how true it is).

Also, how much will using thicker oil lower the fuel economy? I’d rather trade a few MPGs and my vehicle last 400k miles vs. lasting only half that (it’s the equivalent of turbocharged engines; they may get better mileage, AND have more power, but they don’t last like N/A engines). Someone posted that they ran 0w20 and even 0w30 sometimes and it didn’t effect their fuel economy.

Regardless of what oil I’m able to use, I plan to be religious with oil changes (that goes for all fluids). In my current vehicle, I’ve always had my non synthetic oil changed every 3k miles, 3,500 tops, regardless of how much highway travel I’ve done. Some people say that I could probably change it every 5k, but those same people don’t have anywhere near the mileage that my car has. All the drivers with insane mileage, such as Million Mile Joe (put 1 million miles on a Honda) and even the master himself, Irv Gordon (3.2 million on a Volvo P1800) did 3k oil changes, so I know who I want to imitate. There are others with high mileage vehicles, but those two spring to mind. I’d probably change the oill every 5k miles in a Gen 8 Camry, as they use synthetic oil.
 
#2 ·
New Camry requires synthetic. Change every 5,000 miles and alternate between 0-16 abd 0-20 for OCI. Most miles on my car is 150k 2010 Highlander.
 
#3 ·
.... can I increase the longevity of the engine by using 0w20 or thicker vs. the recommended 0w16?

.... Also, how much will using thicker oil lower the fuel economy?
Yes, you could potentially increase engine life by moving to 0w20 weight. Also, if you're relying on a dealer to change your oil, 0w20 (or heavier) is exactly what they're putting in your vehicle as it's cheaper/ more readily available in bulk. (Yes, many dealers don't follow the manual.) All this said, 0w16 has been used in Japan for a very long time and has been proven reliable. It's just new to North America. Also, the electric oil pump in our 8th gen Camrys is meant to work with a lighter weight oil so it can deliver higher/lower pressure on demand. There is a Toyota mechanic on Youtube who describes this in detail and insists owners stick with 0w 16 as recommended.

As to your second question, loss in fuel economy is negligible.

Verdict... it's a great car, and 0w16 vs 0w20 will likely be of far less consequence than simply changing your oil and filter on regular (or even earlier) intervals.
 
#8 ·
Yes, you could potentially increase engine life by moving to 0w20 weight. Also, if you're relying on a dealer to change your oil, 0w20 (or heavier) is exactly what they're putting in your vehicle as it's cheaper/ more readily available in bulk. (Yes, many dealers don't follow the manual.) All this said, 0w16 has been used in Japan for a very long time and has been proven reliable. It's just new to North America. Also, the electric oil pump in our 8th gen Camrys is meant to work with a lighter weight oil so it can deliver higher/lower pressure on demand. There is a Toyota mechanic on Youtube who describes this in detail and insists owners stick with 0w 16 as recommended.

As to your second question, loss in fuel economy is negligible.

Verdict... it's a great car, and 0w16 vs 0w20 will likely be of far less consequence than simply changing your oil and filter on regular (or even earlier) intervals.
Maintenance, maintenance maintenance. Do that and it will last many years, just like your old car. At the end of the day it's a Toyota; the company entire reputation is about reliability and durability and they know that's what sells their vehicles. But that requires owners to follow the maintenance they say needs to be done. For instance if you read the book carefully they say the oil needs to be changed every 5,000 miles not 10,000 miles for severe use. Most people fall under severe use. I fault Toyota for not making this clear in the manual and for not using an advanced oil life monitor like other makes. They use a simple mileage counter.

My daily commute is 90 miles a day round trip, 90% highway driving. My old Acura would give the oil change message at the max allowed 10,000 miles. My wife's Accord, with basically the same engine, would usually trigger the message between 6,000-7,000 miles. Her commute is about 30 miles round trip through the city. Honda uses an algorithm to calculate when the oil needs changed based on driving conditions and environmental conditions. I trusted the Honda system and changed the oil when it said to and that old Acura went 218,000 miles with 10,000 mile oil changes. I don't trust the mileage counter Toyota system so I tend to change the oil a little earlier at around 7,000 miles on the Camry.
Yes, I plan to change it at 5k miles, whether it’s severe use or not. I do mostly Hwy miles as well, and I don’t drive hard. When accelerating, I seldom rev the engine over 3,000 rpms unless I’m merging into traffic, or just in a bad hurry.

Like I said, for those who claim you can go 10k miles between oil changes (or 5-6k for nonsynthetic oil) you never hear of them getting incredibly high mileage. I know someone who has a 93 Chevy truck with 230k miles who changes th oil between 5-7k miles, but he’s had the engine rebuilt at some point, so there it is.
 
#4 ·
The listing has been deleted but there was a clear shot of the odometer when it was active. Just maintain it well. I'm not worried.

 
#154 ·
Indeed.... but with wives, just look at their mother before you sign...
 
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#6 ·
Maintenance, maintenance maintenance. Do that and it will last many years, just like your old car. At the end of the day it's a Toyota; the company entire reputation is about reliability and durability and they know that's what sells their vehicles. But that requires owners to follow the maintenance they say needs to be done. For instance if you read the book carefully they say the oil needs to be changed every 5,000 miles not 10,000 miles for severe use. Most people fall under severe use. I fault Toyota for not making this clear in the manual and for not using an advanced oil life monitor like other makes. They use a simple mileage counter.

My daily commute is 90 miles a day round trip, 90% highway driving. My old Acura would give the oil change message at the max allowed 10,000 miles. My wife's Accord, with basically the same engine, would usually trigger the message between 6,000-7,000 miles. Her commute is about 30 miles round trip through the city. Honda uses an algorithm to calculate when the oil needs changed based on driving conditions and environmental conditions. I trusted the Honda system and changed the oil when it said to and that old Acura went 218,000 miles with 10,000 mile oil changes. I don't trust the mileage counter Toyota system so I tend to change the oil a little earlier at around 7,000 miles on the Camry.
 
#10 ·
Maintenance, maintenance maintenance. Do that and it will last many years, just like your old car. At the end of the day it's a Toyota; the company entire reputation is about reliability and durability and they know that's what sells their vehicles. But that requires owners to follow the maintenance they say needs to be done. For instance if you read the book carefully they say the oil needs to be changed every 5,000 miles not 10,000 miles for severe use. Most people fall under severe use. I fault Toyota for not making this clear in the manual and for not using an advanced oil life monitor like other makes. They use a simple mileage counter.

My daily commute is 90 miles a day round trip, 90% highway driving. My old Acura would give the oil change message at the max allowed 10,000 miles. My wife's Accord, with basically the same engine, would usually trigger the message between 6,000-7,000 miles. Her commute is about 30 miles round trip through the city. Honda uses an algorithm to calculate when the oil needs changed based on driving conditions and environmental conditions. I trusted the Honda system and changed the oil when it said to and that old Acura went 218,000 miles with 10,000 mile oil changes. I don't trust the mileage counter Toyota system so I tend to change the oil a little earlier at around 7,000 miles on the Camry.
I completely agree with you. One concern of mine though with the Gen 8 Camry is that there is more to proper maint. than just oil changes. I'm suspicious of things like "lifetime" trans fluid, PCV valves buried under the intake manifold where people will be least likely to change them or have them changed because the cost will be many $$$ and nothing mentioned in the service schedule about changing them ever, just for a couple of examples.
 
#22 ·
Gen 5 Camry (02-06) do have an transmission dipstick for drain and refill and very easy on maintenance. Newer Toyota on all models don't have an transmission dipstick and is harder to do maintenance (drain + refill) Lifetime transmission fluid ( Scotty Kilmer says nothing last lifetime on fluid and when transmission burn => Does Toyota will give you an new transmission?)
 
#155 ·
I work for a company called Carolina BG. We offer somewhere between 2-5K worth on coverage on your transmission if you get it flushed at 50K miles or less and then every 20-30K after that. and yes we do honor our coverage, I do all of our Maintenace on my personal vehicles'. See if there's a company like ours in your area. It's not BS our product works and we offer services for any fluid you put in your car. Just keep a record of when you start using "our" services and have the documents ready when filing a claim. Hope this helps!
 
#25 ·
They had to, otherwise the car would be $50k and the consumer would go to the brands who are willing to cheapen out on things.

They have had to adapt to a worsening economy along with regulatory demands by environmentalists who want us to all drive hybrids while they drive v12 twin turbos on their way to their private jet.
 
#30 ·
I bought this car with hopes to keep it as long as possible but these things are concerning me... I've never heard of a PCV or EGR valve until now. How do I know if it needs to be changed? I only have 2k miles but long term should I just replace at certain mileage, or wait until there are signs/issues? I don't want to ignore anything and break the engine but I do not see anything in the maintenance booklet and I am not handy with cars.
 
#31 ·
Long lasting is all about maintenance on time ( oil change, coolant change, brake fluid, tranny drain & refill, spark plug, air filter + cabin filter)
Toyota is making harder & harder and more complex for the average consumer & DIY at home.
Especially No more transmission dipstick, can't even check the level fluid anymore or smell if there's any burning.
 
#32 ·
It isn't wrong to keep it a long time, but at a certain mileage I'd be bored of the car already and would want something more modern...300K is impressive enough. I thought most people here would just buy a 20 year Toyota instead of buying new because 'that's what Scotty said'.
 
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#33 · (Edited)
It's all about time. Complexity will happen eventually but as long as it is proven reliable, then it will be reliable.

Fuel injection? Carburetor? Distributor? Coil on plug? Remote key fobs? Gas direct injection? Timing belt? Timing chain? Variable valve timing? Automatic transmissions? Air conditioning? Electronic tbrottle control? Only older folks could perhaps reminisce on the "battles of old vs new" or the "battle of complexity of new technologies" of these types of technologies that eventually proved themselves to be reliable.

The passage of time and Toyota's history to engineer proven and reliable vehicles will determine whether or not a brand new vehicle will be reliable or not.

The only thing I hate about new vehicles is the need to electrify everything when a physical cable or button or switch or knob would do just fine.

If you are scared of the new, then go back to the old until the new becomes old so when you decide on the new you can get an old new.
 
#35 ·
If you are scared of the new, then go back to the old until the new becomes old so when you decide on the new you can get an old new.
341095
 
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#41 ·
I've owned 8 vehicles in my time and I have never had to replace a PCV on any of them. Modern vehicles are very low maintenance compared to how they used to be. I remember when you had to change spark plugs and transmission fluid every 30,000 miles.

What used to be a real pain was when you replaced the distributor and then had to set the engine timing. And when you consider distributors wear out, replacing them was considered routine maintenance or part of the "tune up".
 
#42 ·
What used to be a real pain was when you replaced the distributor and then had to set the engine timing. And when you consider distributors wear out, replacing them was considered routine maintenance or part of the "tune up".
Yep ... plugs, points, condenser on a regular basis, and then setting, or gaping, the points and adjusting the timing. And while under the hood, chances were good the carb would need an adjustment as well. The original plugs in my Camry are still fine at 83,000 miles and 10 years. Haven't been able to locate the carburetor, it must be in there somewhere <LOL>
 
#50 ·
I doubt any modern vehicle's will last as long as our older Toyota's did. You just can not keep making things lighter, more powerful and get better fuel economy and maintain the same level of durability. Every brand is facing this. If you look at how reliable and durable old Mercedes were and compare them to todays Mercedes the modern ones are over priced junk if the measure of value is durability and low cost of ownership! Look at the power and performance though.

So back to your question I doubt it but nothing else on the market is going to be any better than a Toyota with very few possible exceptions.

I would not run anything lighter than Mobil-1 5W30 and my preference would be for M1 0W40. Unless you are just piling on the miles I would change ever 6 months. I like to change oil every 6 months no matter what with a quality synthetic with the cavate of or 10,000 miles which ever comes first! It is not an "either or" pick and choose it is which ever comes first. Any major brand will do but M1 0W40 is what I have the most experience with.

If you really want to run a 5W20 or 0W20 I would not use anything other than Red Line Performance line not Professional Line and not Power Sports Line they are the only brand of oil that has 5W20 and 0W20 that are sufficient in my opinion to properly protect every part of the engine and a beefy additive package not and either or but both hths and stout additive package. Red Line 0W20 has the same hths as most 5w30 oils which is 2.9cS. Their 5W20 has a an hths of 3. I think they both have viscosity indexs in the 170 range and that is not because they are loaded with VI's! Their 0W30 has an hths of 3.4 that is almost into the same level of protection you get from a 40wt. but since it is a 0w it will not impact fuel economy at all.

Toyota 0W16 for example has a fantastic additive package but is lacking in hths.

The real trick is going to be finding a shop to change the atf at 50K miles and do it properly!

Most people do not get this part but the 0WXX part only improves fuel economy the first 15 minutes of driving after that their is no difference between a 0W30 and a 10W30 with regard to fuel economy. The same is true of lower viscosity ATF's and Gear Lubes once the fluid is up to normal operating temperatures you as a consumer save ZERO NOTHING. The improvement in fuel economy though for the OEM is something like 0.0000016% or some insane number that buy itself is worthless but when leveraged across million of vehicle's sold towards they annual CAFE taxes Cooperate Average Fuel Economy tax it saves them millions in taxes. All you get in return for your use of thinner fluids is shorter vehicle life due to increased wear and tear!

Keep the oil between an hths of 2.9 and 4.0 with the sweet spot being around 3.3-3.5 especialy a name brand synthetic and change it at a decent interval and your Toyota engine baring manufacturing defect should live forever!
 
#51 ·
For the record I have ran 0W30, 5W30,10W30,5W40,15W40,0W40, 5W20 and 15W50 oils in my 2003 Camry, 2001 Tundra, 2007 Camry, 2001 Dodge Dakota, 1995 Tacoma, 1998 Buick Lesaber. All of those vehicle's got regular Used Oil Analysis and were test beds for a lot of things for me including at one point blending my own oils from scratch for about 3 years. All of them always had stellar UOA. Never a single engine failure or oil burning or oil related problem. All VVT systems worked fine etc..... 4 of them had oil pressure gauges as well so I could see how long it took to build positive oil pressure, what changed cold vs hot etc. If you include my 1986 4Runner and 1982 Starlet we can include 20W50 and 5W50 oils too!

All of those vehicle's were also test beds for me to play around with all kinds of gear lubes or atf' as well.

When you know you can fix anything you break and you have the money to afford to break things this sort of stuff was fun for me! Having figured out for myself what works and basically proving the engineering white papers I used to have access to correct today I just do what I know works and works fantastically! Currently I am on a finical low as well not in the proper state to go purposefully pushing things to see what is safe and what is not! LOL Soon I should be able to play around but not sure if I want to now. Doing what I know works is easy!

5W20 is currently in the wifes 2007 will sampling it soon. Not that it is indicative of the 5W20 since I am running a cleaning cycle with enough Schaeffers 131 to kill a Dinosaur. Oil consumption is total gone though!
 
#54 ·
Actually most people in America do need to follow "Sever Service" if actual look at what defines it you will find it is the opposite of what most people think.

100K is just a warm up for a Toyota getting rid of one that early is just wasteful. Getting bored with a car is the silliest thing I have ever heard. You do not get rid of your kids or your wife just because you get bored with them or I hope not. How do you get rid of yourself when you get bored with yourself or with life.

I have heard people say that before and I know it is real thing but it also is mind numbingly stupid. What happens when you buy the fastest most exciting sexiest car in the world? Do you rebound and go for the biggest POS ever like say a Austin Midget or Trabant or Yugo? If you just need new to you their is no limit until you get bored with the endless car quest then what?

Boredom is the weakest excuse for the need of endless distraction and novelty based on mass consumerism. It does not make sense from a logic standpoint and it is not psychological sound either. You can never fill that hole or that void that you think is a derivative of boredom. I am not objecting to the finical waste or the right to do what you are doing. What I am getting at is the need for strong introspection to get to grips with the fundamental need for constant novelty and distraction since they can never be satisficed at any cost. It is not until you figure out what is truly missing and driving that addiction will you be able to truly find satisfaction and happiness internally so it is not driven by outside of you. At some point there is an ideal combination that does everything you want and need the vehicle to do and once you find that machine it is pointless to go on to another short of changing need or the vehicle wearing out.

Now back to the topic at hand.

All brands are doing things that make it harder to maintain a vehicle especialy for those that do not have the skills of an actual mechanic. This is not exclusive to Toyota. Look at the disaster of Fords Eco Boost engines! Look at the dreadful V6 uber expensive labor intensive water pump issue with the V6 used in the Mustang and other vehicle's. Look at all the CVT's that fail like a clock work from almost all brands. Look at the complexity and short comings of most GDI systems and most turbo charged systems on the market! I am just scratching the surface. Who do you think makes a more reliable vehicle at any price point than Toyota over all industry wide? This is the dark age of automotive choices since they all suck! They are more expensive than ever and the least durable market wide than ever in history of the industry. Sure power and fuel economy are up for the most part but what good is that if a car or truck costs as much as your home but does not last. If you do not want to buy a Toyota do not buy a Toyota but it is a fools folly to think the grass is greener on the other side of the fence! The only real thing to do is to buy a V8 while you can and suck up the higher fuel costs and not complain about it like most cry babies do! If you do not want to have garbage fuel economy do not buy a vehicle with bad fuel economy. Cave man simple and preferably with out cylinder deactivation. Run thicker oil than is recommended and do not idle them a lot! Avoid anything turbo charged if you can and avoid GDI systems that do not also include a port fuel injection system as well! Do not buy any new models or anything with a new engine or transmission until they have been on the market a while and the bugs have been worked out. That is about the best you can do.

Short of buying an older vehicle with older technology that has wear and tear on it what else can you do? The market is not going to slow down or do a 180 for a long time. I figure it will be another 10 years before the small turbo GDI ever more complex craze runs it course. Same thing for the ever thinner oils and gear lubes and atf's! The current path is not sustainable but electric vehicles are also not sustainable for a number of reasons not the least of which is the stupidity of "Green Energy Push". The problem driving the automotive industry into the ground is politics plain and simple. Until we fix that insanity it will forever infect everything it touches with stupidity like the EPA has been doing for some time! We the consumer can not get away from it until we fix that! So no brand is safe you will have to do your home work and I mean serious home work before each purchase on par with planning your own European vacation not just purchasing a package deal. Those not willing to get smart on the topic and do research will suffer the random fate that ignorance and consumerism brings to the table!

Every car or truck I have owned with each newer year became more and more difficult to work on even simple things like replacing a belt or replacing an alternator or power steering pump. Each newer year that much harder to diagnose. Each one less durable and reliable. This is nothing new this is what idiots call "progress"! LOL
 
#75 ·
Actually most people in America do need to follow "Sever Service" if actual look at what defines it you will find it is the opposite of what most people think.

100K is just a warm up for a Toyota getting rid of one that early is just wasteful. Getting bored with a car is the silliest thing I have ever heard. You do not get rid of your kids or your wife just because you get bored with them or I hope not. How do you get rid of yourself when you get bored with yourself or with life.
Unfortunately some people have done exactly that with spouses or themselves. :(

It's ironic that you're bringing up cars and people, because someone here compared me having an old Echo and a 3 year old Camry to cheating. The Echo is basic no frills transportation, you have to shift your own gears, has a lot of miles, and not pretty, but has been very reliable to me for the last 20 years. The Camry is younger with less than one tenth the mileage, has almost all the bells and whistles you can get on a car, a nice looking exterior, auto trans. I didn't buy the Camry because I was bored with the Echo though, the Camry filled a specific need at the time, like the truck does sometimes. Now the need for the Camry or a car like it has gone away, but I still have the Camry. I don't need it but now that I've drove it for a few months I want it.

The good thing is though one car doesn't get jealous if I drive the other one, or even if I drive the pickup truck or van. At the end of the day though they're all just vehicles. If one or the other gets totaled in an accident insurance will eventually make it right, and I'm not going to have a funeral for either one of them.

I have heard people say that before and I know it is real thing but it also is mind numbingly stupid. What happens when you buy the fastest most exciting sexiest car in the world? Do you rebound and go for the biggest POS ever like say a Austin Midget or Trabant or Yugo? If you just need new to you their is no limit until you get bored with the endless car quest then what?
I hate to say it but I sort of did exactly that, although not out of boredom. I had a 2 seater convertible sports car with a powerful 289 V-8 engine, designed by Carl Shelby. I sold it because it was too tempting to not drive it fast, and if I'd done that for very long I'd either have an accident or no drivers license. My next car purchase was a used Mustang II with a 4 cylinder, the 2nd biggest vehicle mistake I ever made. :(
 
#57 ·
I love how folks say that cars are not as reliable as they used to be and that couldn't be farther from the truth. The average age of a vehicle on the road now is pushing 12 years old. These are from all makes not just Toyota. Even some of the least reliable vehicles made today can make it to 100,000 miles pretty easily.

The reality of the industry now is there are fewer and fewer suppliers so they're all buying from the same suppliers. When Borg Warner's plant caught on fire it disrupted production of Toyota Tundras and Ford F series trucks because Borg Warner supplies transfer cases to both brands. Now with that said there are some bad area

If you do the required maintenance, keep a coat of wax on it and fix small problems before they become big problems a new 2021 Camry will still be there for you in 2031 running just as strong as it is today.
 
#58 ·
I love how folks say that cars are not as reliable as they used to be and that couldn't be farther from the truth. The average age of a vehicle on the road now is pushing 12 years old. These are from all makes not just Toyota. Even some of the least reliable vehicles made today can make it to 100,000 miles pretty easily.

The reality of the industry now is there are fewer and fewer suppliers so they're all buying from the same suppliers. When Borg Warner's plant caught on fire it disrupted production of Toyota Tundras and Ford F series trucks because Borg Warner supplies transfer cases to both brands. Now with that said there are some bad area

If you do the required maintenance, keep a coat of wax on it and fix small problems before they become big problems a new 2021 Camry will still be there for you in 2031 running just as strong as it is today.
Well I would say not as durable! Not as easy to diagnose! Not as easy to repair! Not as affordable to maintain or repair!
 
#61 ·
The 1988 you would just short a connector and read the flashes from the check engine light to determine trouble codes pre-OBD2. The few sensors on the vehicle could be easily tested with $10 multi-meter from Radio Shack and a $5 test light. A pet rock could trouble shoot it. No CAN BUS 100% analog so it was easy to test and fix or bypass a system or modify a system.

Power densities were low and all the parts were forged, cast iron, closed deck, huge brass radiators and a lot of rear drive cars from $3800 like the Starlet econo hatch on up. Keep in mind My family has owned Toyota's since 1975 or1976 Corina I think it was. We had 4 different vehicle's that were with us over 23 years one that was with us on the road for 30 years. The first carburetor I rebuilt was in middle school on a 4KC 1982 Toyota Starlet. That was around 1987 or 1988. I also did my first brake job on it. The first vehicle I turned rotors on myself and mounted tires on was our 1986 4Runner as a young apprentice in Germany. The first vehicle I modified with fat cam and custom tuned fuel injection system was again that 1986 4Runner. First car I restored was a Alpha Romeo Spider also as an apprentice. In 1986 the 4Runner had better front brakes than a Corvette it had 4 piston clone of Brembo calipers. That whippy 22RE 4Runner had massive 3rd member rear end that was very similar to a Mopar 8 3/4 rear end or the Ford 9 inch even though it had a scant 115hp and 140ft-lbs of torque. The Mopar 8 3/4 was used behind the 426 Hemi to give you an idea of how over kill that was in the 4Runner.

Toyota's reputation for durability started int he 1970's and peaked in the late 1980's. They were routinely racking up 300K-500K miles not as rare but as a matter of routine with dino oil 3000-5000 mile OCI and every other oil change filter changes for 6K-10K mile oil filter changes.

Todays most modern Toyota engines are not even rebuildable they are more like BMW, Porsche and Mercedes designs that are throw away should you wear one out of suffer any sort of failure. The 2AZFE is at least rebuildable in spite of it's many faults. Going forward this will become the norm for all of their designs I am sure unless buyers revolt.

When I decided needed a new transmission because my mom and dad sold my old transmission while I was in college and had a V8 in my 4Runner I purchased a rebuilt manual from Marlin Crawler for $362 shipped to my apartment while in college. I put my 4Runner back to stock. If I wanted to rebuild the transmission in my 2003 Camry which is a manual I can buy most of the parts I need on the after market bearings, synchro's, gaskets, bushing, shims, shift fork shoes etc...in a kit for $500 and rebuild it in my garage with hand tools I already own. Try to rebuild an automatic yourself let alone for $500. I have rebuilt a couple of automatics in my life and modified GM automatics and it is never easy if you do not do automatics as your day job and if you do not have a lot of specialized tools it is slow, frustrating and might not go well your first try! Never mind needing a scan tool or software that can not only read transmission codes but reset them and the memory as well since the days of just disconnecting the battery is long gone to reset things.

Anything less than a $500 scan tool or TechStream is like spitting into the wind if you want to do anything serious. I need a new one in fact nothing lasts forever. In fact until the first Tacoma's came off GM/Toyota Nummi Plant you could previously take apart and reassemble every Toyota ever made up to the point with a $149 Sears Craftsman tool kit. The poorly made Harrison radiator used in the 1995.5 Tacoma used Torq bits can not recall if they were protected or not.

Nope once things went from analog to digital can bus it has been down hill for DIY. Likewise once blocks went to cast aluminum it has been a slow march into planned obsolesces and outrageous prices to repair what used to be fairly simple and straight forward repairs. Today when an engine blows a head gasket often a lot of damage is done fairly quickly if not caught right away. Just look at how expensive it is to repair a 2AZFE that rips it's block threads out or to repair a 2AZFE that has oil consumption issues.

The newer engines with PCV/ oil baffles buried in the engine and made from plastic are going to be labor intensive for something that should be easy routine maintenance.
 
#63 ·
Anything less than a $500 scan tool or TechStream is like spitting into the wind if you want to do anything serious
you can literally buy a $30 adapter on ebay/amazon. it comes with techstream. setup a virtual machine in your laptop pc with usb passthru, install, and you are now free to do all kind of serious stuff.
 
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